Let's talk about S E X

Kate is adamant she does not want to have children.  Or a husband. Firstly because she doesn't want to kiss a boy EVER (or a girl, but especially not a boy. Kissing is gross and boys are even grosser) and secondly because she doesn't want anyone to cut her tummy open to take the baby out.  I've explained to her that it isn't sore because they give you medicine to numb the pain but there is no way ON EARTH she is going to let someone cut her tummy.

After failing to convince her about the benefits of a spinal block epidural (without having to mention the injection in the back because OMG! can you imagine the shock and horror about that! The child is totally pain averse), I thought it might be time to inform her that vaginas are not just for ornamental use.  

"Well Kate, there is another way that babies come out.  Babies can also come out of one's fanny" (<-- yes, very bad - we use 'fanny' instead of vagina and 'tummy' instead of stomach.  Minus 700 parenting points)

The look on her face was priceless:  "WELL, I AM CERTAINLY NOT EVER GOING TO HAVE A BABY THEN!" she said in horror.  No amount of me explaining that it was natural and millions of women do it that way etc etc was going to convince her. The cut in the tummy was bad enough but a baby coming out your fanny..... there is just no way.  

We spoke about adoption and surrogacy but she decided that she didn't want to take a chance that she got a naughty baby like Max.  Luckily Adam is going to have plenty of children so hopefully I will have grandchildren one day.  Kate is going to live with me forever so that the two of us can be together forever.  Apparently Dad, Max and Adam can buy a house next door to the two of us and they can come visit occasionally.  

Which is a long introduction to the main point I want to discuss - when is the right age / stage to speak to my children about sex?  Between the C-sections and the IVFs, we have had no need to refer to vaginas in any other way than a passing mention or a request to wash aforementioned bits.

Kate is not particularly interested in how babies are made due to the fact that they are not scheduled to feature prominently in her future (and I am not sure she is ready to learn more right now) but Adam might be ready to learn more. He seems quite a bit more mature and I know that some of his friends have older brothers and sisters, which means they might know about sex - if not now, then soon. He also already told me that so-and-so kissed so-and-so on the lips.  (HORROR!!!!)

At the moment they know all about seeds and eggs and fertilization in petri dishes and two cell embryos dividing into four cell embryos, embryo transfer and implantation etc.  They have a very good understanding of IVF but they have no idea that some people opt for the old fashioned, retro approach of S E X when making babies.  

I don't want my children to find out about sex on the playground, or be embarrassed by their friends when hearing things at school.  I would like to be the one to tell them, but selfishly, I would prefer to delay it as far as I can, if possible. I want them to be ready to hear about sex, and I want to be the one to tell them.

When did you have the sex talk with your children? When were you told as a child? How does one tell?  I know that you only give as much information as they ask for, but at some point I need to tell them that sex involves the meeting of the penis and the vagina.  (Which is not something I am looking forward to, but not nearly as much as I am not looking forward to any mention of mom and dad's vagina and penis being involved in such meetings).  We have discussed the mechanics of conception and fertilization, our next step to talk about is sex.  Damn.  I really don't wanna.  Can't they stay innocent babies for ever??

If anyone has any good books / ideas / references, I would appreciate it.  (My kids will be 8 years old in Jan)

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UPDATE:  When you speak, I listen.  Have ordered the following eBooks for the kids.  Will email a link to the books and tell them to read it on their iPads themselves.

Only joking.  Have ordered the books and will read through the books together. Thanks for all your suggestions, keep them coming.

Items Ordered Price 1 of: It's Not the Stork!: A Book About Girls, Boys, Babies, Bodies, Families and Friends (The Family Library) [Paperback]  By: Robie H. Harris, Michael Emberley $8.63 1 of: It's So Amazing!: A Book about Eggs, Sperm, Birth, Babies, and Families (The Family Library) [Paperback]  By: Robie H. Harris, Michael Emberley $9.17   1 of: It's Perfectly Normal: Changing Bodies, Growing Up, Sex, and Sexual Health (The Family Library) [Paperback]  By: Robie H. Harris, Michael Emberley $7.13

The best part - it didn't cost me anything!!  When I went to pay, Amazon said I had $60 credit loaded on my account - woo hoo!  I had totally forgotten about that. Old age forgetfulness FTW!

Comments

[RainbowW]

i'm not much on the sex talk ... but there's also the puberty thing, for which you might consider these:

http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Happening-Body-Book-Girls/dp/1557047642/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1347785643&sr=8-1&keywords=what%27s+happening+to+my+body+book+for+girls

http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Happening-Body-Book-Boys/dp/1557047693/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1347785654&sr=8-1&keywords=what%27s+happening+to+my+body+book+for+boys

[melissa]

haha, your daughter sounds like mine. NOT keen to give birth either way, she does however want to marry and have a Chinese baby, so we have to find her a Chinese man and perhaps she'll have the baby under general :-) And she's going to live with me forever so I'm going to have to extend the house to accomodate her and her Chinese family. I am waiting for them to ask before I tackle the s*x question ... Suppose I should start thinking about what I'm going to say ...

[Sharon]

Hi Tertia, I started talking to Jess about the differences between boys and girls from about the age of 4 when she was starting Educare as I too did not want the "show and tell" version from the playground!
I have found a good book that is in easy to follow pictures and tips for parents, The Big Book about Sex and my Body. Published by Penstock. I think that I got it from the bookshop in the Pick n Pay centre in Durbanville but I am sure that any bookshop would have it.
What I like about it is that we have gone through it together and now that Jess is 13 I am giving it to her to read again on her own and then ask any questions she may have.
Hope that is some help, difficult when we realise that our "little" ones are not so little anymore!
Lots of hugs. xx

[Jackie JvR]

There is a saying that '8 is too late'. I think you need to have that chat asap. Unfortunately, my son saw a video of a man 'pee-ing' (probably ejaculating) on a woman, on a friend's phone, when he was 7/8. He also had the mechanics of a blow job explained to him by a friend when he was 8.

I believe that if you chat about sex (in an age-appropriate way) often and normally, it is never a big, scary deal. And it keeps the channels of communication open, so that they feel safe to tell you what they heard/saw. Then you have a great opportunity to talk calmly about values and morals, biology and nature. I still have those chats with my 26 and 16 year olds.

Good luck! :-)

[Candy]

I still remember the books my mother gave to my brother and me. "Where did I come from?", and "What is Happening to me?" - by Peter Mayle. I have given them as gifts to friends of mine with kids...I think I still have mine somewhere in a box.

[lysergica]

This is an excellent book. I got it for my 8yo
http://www.amazon.com/Its-So-Amazing-Families-Library/dp/0763613215

[Tara]

I remember in sub A I found this book in the library: http://books.google.co.za/books/about/How_your_body_works.html?id=9BVMVe57VOMC&redir_esc=y which laid the basics down for me with lovely little robot metaphors - it was so engaging I remember reading it at least 3 times. By the time my mom and my aunt asked me if I knew what sex was, I was all up to date and ready to inform them. I'm sure they were glad that I had saved them from the horror of the talk.

[jokevn]

Years ago we had a whole series of little books in the library in George Children's section on how different animals procreate. Mammals, birds, fish, butterflies, etc. I used to take them out with other books and we would together, from a relative early age, marvel at how animals procreate. So it was a matter of fact, natural progression to how humans procreate and never an issue. If you stress, they will feel it and react. When we were young our dogs would mate and have babies, so a total natural occurrence. Modern city children do not have these opportunities any more but we do have books on these topics :)

[Karen]

I also highly recommend this one! I have an. 11 year old and he has had this one for a few years.
http://www.amazon.com/Its-So-Amazing-Families-Library/dp/0763613215
He now has the next level up which Goes into more emotional detail for kids actually hitting puberty. That ine is called "it's perfectly normal."

[Orange]

I also recommend "It's So Amazing." Its drawings cover families of various colors, families with two moms, etc., and the written material includes a bit on assisted reproduction, along with sex, puberty, adoption, recognizing inappropriate touching, and so on. We started reviewing various topics with Ben when he was about 7-8. Now that he's 12, we've also very frankly discussed things like masturbation, poorly-timed erections, and wet dreams, so he'll know what they are when they hit and that they're utterly normal.

Here's a Kalahari link to buy "It's So Amazing": http://www.kalahari.com/books/Its-So-Amazing/632/9468142.aspx

The same author, Robie Harris, also has a sequel, "It's Perfectly Normal," that gets into more detail about the changes that puberty brings. We've got that one too.

[Claire]

Where did I come from? And What's happening to me? are fabulous. http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0818402539

[liza]

I second and third the Robie Harris series, but would point out that I think
It's Not the Stork!: A Book About Girls, Boys, Babies, Bodies, Families and Friends (The Family Library)
is the one to start with; it is written for the youngest age of the three books ( stork, amazing and perfectly normal)
by the time my kid was eight she was definitely reading its son amazing, but, ymmv.

[Shelly]

There is a lovely childrens book called "Mommy laid an egg" by Babette Cole that is suitable for young children. I have used it for my children at Grade one and it seemed to have done the trick..
All the best!

[Nima]

The school told LR all about it ages ago, I nearly shat my pants when I found out. On the plus side it saved me ever having that conversation.

[Nina]

FYI its not Nima it your sister Nina!

[Karinsamira]

Hi Tertia!

As a child, I loved, loved , loved my Lennart Nilsson book! Not only had it pics from various stages of embrional/fetal development, but also some drawings of sex and hat happens then. I was so fascinated! I got that book at a young age (cant even remember when) and would look at it often because I was so thrilled. I grew up in an open-minded family (at least in this respect) and it was just great. With my own kids (ages 11, 4 and 2 year old twins) I do the same: they have their books, see mommy go through pg, all of their questions are always answered to best knowledge (ok this is easy...I am a biologist plus I did all those IF tx for many many years).

[Kristin]

While I've never hidden anything from my children, they had the full blown talk when they were about 10. It went hand in hand with the puberty talk...fun, fun.

[Sara]

I was 7 when I found out by asking my mom. Of course your kids probably won't do this, though, since they already know about IVF. Maybe you can casually drop the fact that Max was not conceived by IVF into conversation, and see where the conversation goes to start this important discussion.

Good luck Tertia! If you can tell the whole internet some of the things that you tell us, telling your kids about sex should be a breeze. Or not. ;-)

[Keri]

As a Planned Parenthood Sexuality Educator, the time to talk to your children about sexuality, not just sex, is now. Best book to help you and the kids more comfortable talking about it is Robie Harris and Michael Emberly's book: "It's So Amazing." They have written books geared for younger and older kids but that particular book is perfect for Adam and Kate's age. The comic-style pictures are absolutely beautiful and make it a lighter topic to discuss. My kids love the book. Good luck! :)

[Wobs]

Kate is priceless! She really makes me chuckle.

[Stefanie]

By 8, most kids know a whole lot. Our schools in the States start health (what we called sex ed) in 3rd grade (7-8 year olds). I took what was taught to my kids and went back over it and let them ask questions that they were to shy to ask in class. My daughter took it all in like science, my son laughed his was through. Pretty typical, I'm sure.

[Sarah]

We use that series with my daughter, she has absolutely no embarrassment or discomfort with talking about her body or sex, which I credit the books and the discussions we had around them. I would definitely stick with the age appropriate book and when they are more curious go on to the next. It is a lot of information, so letting one soak in at a time I think is good. My son has absolutely no interest at all. But I am hoping that he will also view talking about these things as not a huge deal because we are treating it like a normal topic.

[Michelle]

I love seeing that Harris & Emberley's books are being recommended over & over. We have a 20-month-old (thank you IVF & ICSI!), and I've already bought their "stork" book for him. I've just left it in his pile of books, and figure someday he'll pluck it out & look at it, and we can start the conversation from there. I love that there is info on ART & such in there as well.