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I'm in the same boat: very grateful for the child I have, and wishing I could just accept that there won't be another. That way, if I got a surprise, it would just be a lovely surprise, and I wouldn't have to be disappointed every goddamn month.

And why is it so hard to get rid of the baby gear? I've tried loaning it out to friends, and they've now given it all back, and I still don't have a baby to use it.

Stupid hope. So annoying.

It's murphy's bloody law - get rid of the baby stuff and you'll find yourself pregnant. Having said that, if it doesn't happen you'll probably hunt me down and kill me and then ask all my friends to help you hid my body....

You want to hear something funny? When I first read that monitor, I thought it said "HOT Fertile"! I was like no wonder she hasn't gotten pg on her own...her cycle is way out of whack to be fertile on cd 1! ;)

it's more fun when you don't worry about it. then go "oh shit!" when you start throwing up.

it's what i do.

(except i actively try, she just doesn't worry about it.)

I wish you peace, Tertia. I know that pain of obsessing. I know it well. It's damned difficult to work through.

Perhaps in time you won't obsess but I know I would. Maybe you could just not beat yourself up for obsessing? That would be a start. New rule - every time you have a hopeful thought about being pregnant just say "well of ocurse I do - who wouldn't?" and then see if you can let it go. No beating yourself up, though - that's off the table.

As for the baby stuff - if you get rid of it you can always get more if you need it, right? It just depends on your storage situation. It's all about storage. Nothing more than storage. See how that works?

Signed -

I'm with Wobs here. But don't sell, give your stuff away. The poop money you get for 2nd hand stuff is not worth it anyway. The bright side of this saga is at least Marko gets shagged more often. If you knew there was zero chance the guy would be in the love dessert!

It starts harmlessly enough:

Well hello there, I suddenly feel so damn horny -darling let's shag! That's why I wore this underwear... Fertile time? Is it? How would I know, my love, it's just because you're so HOT I want to rip your clothes off. And yesterday too, and probably tomorrow and the day after, but after that not so much. At all.

Somehow this inexorably turns into what Akeeyu called 'Forced Death March Sex'. I was going to write it out with details but it's too damn depressing, and basically boils down to: Oh for heaven's sake just COME will you?

If you possibly can avoid it, don't spend too long on this path sweetie, because it sucks.

Yep, every single month I try to time sex around ovulation, and then wait until such time as I can decide my period MIGHT be late, and then pee on a stick ... despite the fact that it took us five IVFs to get PG the one time I got PG, and I've had two failed IVFs since then while watching my FSH skyrocket. Now if that's not stupid, I don't know what is.

If I ever did get PG naturally, like you, I'm sure I'd be 100 times more obsessed.

Guess hope springs eternal.

'Mail order babies' now why didn't I think of that !!!! Don't we all wish.....Wish I could send you something to make you feel better though, more wine maybe :)

Now why am I not surprised? I'd be the same way. I wish I could bottle up my fertility and send it to you - I don't want it or need it anymore. My kids are 11 and 6 (plus ds is 19), I'm not starting over.

That should be: (plus dsd is 19) Got to fast for myself..

I am at the point of asking my partner to have a vascetomy just to remove the issue and the hope so I can mentally move on.

I love you T, and I've been here for years, following your journey. Long before my own started, or I even knew there would be one. Anyway, I say this because I care. Consider it a good, hard shake.

Stop it. Stop. It. You will go nuts. My husband and I have a small chance of a spontaneous pregnancy (booked in for ICSI though because it's that ridiculously small!) and we've done it before (very short lived miracle), but I have to think in terms of our infertility being absolute, or I can't cope. Even with one slightly unusual symptom of my cycle, I'm falling on pregnancy tests.

Sell the baby stuff. If you get pregnant naturally, you can buy more and you will find the money to do so. I had anorexia as a teen, and now, if I get a bit 'cuddly' for any clothes, they go out. It's not worth the thoughts that come from something being a bit snug. Do you know what I mean? It's the same principal.

Also - embrace happy credits! Treat yourself, every single day. Have a Belgian chocolate before bed, or for breakfast even!! Have an extra wine, or spend an extra half hour online, or leave the dishes till the next day. Give yourself something every day to look forward to and be positive about - change your focus. It'll take time to readjust your thinking but it will be worth it for your sanity.

Do something around the end/start of your cycle for the same reason - something to look forward to and be positive about. A hair appointment, a new piece for your wardrobe - something a little bit bigger than your daily treats. Don't think in terms of expense doing this, think of it as saving your sanity. Plus, if you had a baby, that would add cost to your budget anyway :-)

I'll send you a column I did on this recently for a website, later in the day. It's for 'normal' people trying to conceive, but the principal is the same.

xoxo Always thinking of you.

Dear Tertia, as the best way to avoid the risk of risk ruining your life, I would suggest to: (1) give away all the baby stuff, including the very depressing fertility monitor; (2) spend money and time on fun things, not doctors (unless is for new boobs). (3) have a lot of sex for pleasure only.

I get it. I'm the same way. If you are going to obsess about doing another IVF for the near future and being haunted by not doing it, then you have to, some how, scrape the funds together and try again.

I'm copying this from another site: In the mean time have you heard of new concept: Pregnancy helps repair damaged organs?

"It seems that in every pregnancy some fetal cells pass across the placenta into the mother's ciruculation; doesn't matter if the fetus/baby is a boy or a girl.

In discussing fetal cells that enter maternal circulation during pregnancy (microchimerism), a commentary article in April 4, 2007 JAMA issue [297:1489-91] states, "Recently an alternative interpretation [alternative to idea that these cells may be harmful] has developed: namely, that these pregnancy-associated progenitor cells may have a beneficial role and participate in the repair of maternal disease or injury."

These fetal cells may be a form of stem cell that are capable of going to a damaged organ, such as liver or heart, and have a "multilineage capacity," which means help to repair that damaged organ. That would be a side-benefit from pregnancy-"

*If* the above were true could it have been possible that your ovaries, an organ, were somehow benefited by fetal cells and that is why, how you became non-ART pregnant?


I have only recently come to the conclusion that sex does not equal babies in my case either.

It would be a total mindfuck in the extreme to go and do it naturally, but that doesn't stop me trying either.

Not to challenge you too much, but I am stretched to understand how it is the money that is stopping you from doing another cycle.

You've written extensively about how IVF in South Africa is a fraction of what it costs in the U.S. That would be $3,000 -- $5,000 U.S. maybe??? You and your husband both work ... at good jobs. Your blog generates income. You write freelance stories.

I'm not saying it would be easy, nor that you should do it, but I am challenged to see that money is really the limiting factor here. And I don't mean to offend you ... just asking.

A mind fuck indeed. I can empathise. As I start to pack up baby clothes that no longer fit I struggle between selling them and saving them for a "what-if....maybe...stranger-things-have-happened" baby. Nothing about infertility is easy. Secondary infertilty may not be as hard but it's still a bitch.

When you find the answer to this mind fuck will you please share as I too would love to stop the ridiculous hope (okay, it is really more like an obsession) about a "surprise baby." I don't understand why I can't focus solely on the daughter I never thought I would have and let this obsession with having a baby the old fashioned way go.

I have never been able to proactively shake an obsession. It just dies a natural death one day and I don't miss it. But, between now and then... well, look out!!!
I don't when that day will come for you, but, I hardly think giving away/selling the baby things has anything to do with it in the least.
I think you probably already know that.
One day you just won't notice they are there.
Then another day you will just toss them all as they are taking up valuable space.
On a final note... just my assvice... but:

Get thee to the couch!!!!!!!!!!

Give all baby stuff away. New babies need new stuff anyway. Have sex for pleasure.

Maybe give all the baby stuff to Bosom Buddies. That way, good karma may assist with the bad feelings? Plus, you know you'll be helping very needy mothers and bubs.

How very sad is this?? I am a fertile 39 year old women with a beautiful 10 year old daughter and desperate for another baby which I could easily conceive but have no partner ........ How I wish I could just give you my bod for 10 months or so. It actually makes me feel so guilty.

Same thing happened to me. After 10 years of trying and finally being told IVF was our only hope (and therefore, settled on adoption), I got pregnant naturally only to lose the baby at 8 weeks. After that, TOTALLY obsessed with being pregnant again. I think some of that is the natural feeling after a miscarriage. Your body just craves being pregnant again. It took us 8 months - and we conceived the month our first baby would have been due. Now have an active toddler running around.

I didn't feel the baby-making obsession go away till about 7 months post-miscarriage. I finally felt at peace with whatever the outcome. 1 month later, I got pregnant. I don't know how to get to the peace stage. if I did, I'd be rich. But, I do know that it's normal to feel this way. I hope it happens for you again quickly. What you're going through sucks in the extreme.

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