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I agree - I think the dry cleaning industry is in collusion with the tobacco industry. I don't smoke and hate everything about it, but smokers force my nice going out wear to be dry cleaned for the smell when it would be otherwise perfectly acceptable to wear again sans cleaning. Pffffph.

So right, and isn't all the legal gumph actually about not smoking in public places? What in heaven's name is just outside the door? Not public places? I, Miss Joe Public is trying to get in the door, for heavens sake. Of course it isn't a public place.

Having a good holiday?

i am so with you! I gave up smoking the moment I found out I was pregnant. And it's been nearly 3 years. Hubby was supposed to also stop, but he started again - something to do with stress, GAH! I make him wash his hands before picking up our child. And no stinky cloths may lay around the bedroom. I'm definitely the worst kind of non-smoker!

Oh, smoking RIGHT OUTSIDE THE FREAKING DOOR!! I probably bitch about it on a daily basis. I like acting all disgusted...pulling a face and waving my hand in front of my face. I know it won't help, but maybe someone might notice that its not OK with Everyone to walk through their nauseating cloud...

I am in Northern Ireland and this time next year there will be a smoking ban in place in all workplaces. This includes bars and clubs and I cannot wait for the time when I can go for a drink without coming ome smelling like an ashtray!! The ban is already in place in the Republic of Ireland. Heaven!!

re smoking "right outside the freaking door", it's like dennis leary said, "we gave you the whole goddamn plane, and you're still not happy."

you make us go outside, fine, we go outside. but it actually kind of makes me laugh to see people with their prissy looks having to run a gauntlet of the smokers who used to be safely tucked away inside a lounge at the back of the restaurant blowing smoke in their faces from "right outside the freaking door." a definite case of things backfiring, eh?

it's one thing to talk about the dangers of smoking oneself, the dangers of a child growing up in a home where the parents smoke indoors in the child's presence, etc. but cigarette smoke, despite popular belief, is not actually going to kill you on contact. but that's how people act nowadays. "you're poisoning my air!" lady, why don't you go yell at that bus driver? his vehicle is pumping much more deadly pollution into your air this very minute than my tiny little cigarette. and if you weren't in my face, maybe there wouldn't be as much smoke in yours...

i'm not trying to say that smoking is GOOD or that i'm awesome for doing it. and of course this has nothing to do with tertia's reasons for being upset about it--and i'm actually glad i know that, because next time someone gives me a dirty look i'll think of her and not be so irritated.

but seriously, people need to RELAX.

beth I'm highly sensitive to cigarette smoke and it can trigger breathing difficulties in me. It also stinks. It makes my hair and clothes smell awful which being as I have terrible morning sickness makes me ill. In my experience smokers have no idea just how bad it smells or how far that smell reaches.

Where I live from July it will be illgal to smoke in any enclosed place or within 4 metres of the entry of any public building. I can't wait.

You may think that those of us holding our breath and looking disgusted are just trying to be morally superior. But in some cases we're just genuinely trying not to puke on you.

Amen Sistah!!! I quit in 2000 and am a born again non-smoker. They do the same thing in the US, herd together in front of buildings sucking on their cigs ~ yukcity!!! I think the air freshner idea is brilliant. You rock.

We have a smoking ban in bars here in NYC and it annoys me no end. At least before I knew just to stay out of bars. Now they're all spilled out onto the street waving their cancer waft right where other people are trying to breathe.

I encounter so many polite smokers every day. The kind who hold their cigarettes away and off to the side when they see my kids, so not only do the kids not have to breath any smoke but they don't even see the cigarette! But then every few days we run into some asshole who blows smoke right into my face or my kids' faces (I've even seen people blow smoke at dogs on leashes!). I wonder if some people subconsciously blame non-smokers for their own addiction and try to take it out on kids and animals.

Beth, have you ever thought that some of us just think it smells nasty? I go out of my way to avoid smelling other nasty chemicals. Why don't I have the right to avoid cigarette smoke? Why should other people be prey to your habit? I do wish you could still be tucked away in a lounge still, because there's not much choice about where I can walk if I'm trying to get into a building. The comparison to a bus doesn't hold, because a bus provides a common good and smoking doesn't. The comparison of people driving huge polluting SUVs for no reason is probably a better one. (Go Sox.)

I fall into the "makes me puke" category - I have actually tossed a biscuit or two (or 10) in my day from the smell of it. It is just one of those things. I actually consider this reflexive action a blessing - smoking has NEVER been something I've considered because of it!

This Sunday, it will be 3 years since I last smoked. I, too, have a husband who can take it or leave it. If he is working the occasional night shift, he smokes with everyone else. I can smell it yards away when he does. He is the type who can smoke 1 or 2 a day. Me? I was a pack a day smoker.

At one point in time, I was a two pack a day smoker. I live in the US and am 50. When I started smoking, one could and did smoke anywhere. Grocery store, work (had a huge butt-filled ashtray on my desk), any type of shopping. During a shopping expedition, there was nothing quite like going into a shoe store, plopping down with the shopping bags, lighting up, and having a shoe salesman putting on and taking off my shoes. Imagine that arrogance. Awful.

I quit smoking during my pregnancies. During my first pregnancy, there were women smoking on the maternity ward. By the second, 4 years later, smoking was not allowed. I'd also quit for several years here and there throughout my life, but started again the day my mother died in 1992.

I seem to have developed a highly attuned sense of smell as a result of quitting. I work in a small office. We had a visitor whose body odor was horrendous...not the usual B.O., just an general unwashed smell. No one else could sense it, non-smokers all. Turns out that this man had been traveling and not washing regularly.

I don't miss smoking. It is an extremely anti-social activity anymore. But I have said that if I was to be diagnosed with a life-ending disease and there was no chance of my recovery, I could be found sitting at a cafe table in the Piazza della Signoria in Florence with a carton of Marlboros and a half-litre of the house wine.

Great thread, Tertia :)

I am a closet smoker, and have smoked about 5 cigarettes a day for fifteen years. I've also never smoked when pregnant or nursing. I'm now expecting our second in seven weeks, so I feel like it's getting to acid test time. I can stay quit when someone else is actively depending on my body's resources, but for some reason, not otherwise.

I hope to stay quit this time. Thanks for the inspiration :)

I won't be happy until smoking is banned from indoors, outdoors and in private homes. Civil rights? Freedom? BAH!!

This post was made for me. I am coming up on my 3rd anniversary of being "nicotine" free, June 2, 2003 was my last smoke. It was when we decided to do hubbie's vas-reversal. I knew I had to quit before I got pg, I don't have your willpower, I could never just "stop". Now it's 3yrs later and still no pg. OMG, I loved my smokes. Menthol slims, very lady like. But you are right - the smell - yuck gross. Plus the burning sensation in the bottom of my lungs at 27yrs old was a little scarey. Thank god that cleared up in a matter of days.

To quit I read the book "the easy way to stop smoking" which uses cognitive thinking skills - quit cold turkey. I have only quit once, it was too hard, that is what keeps me from ever starting again.
I am much like you, I could never do 3 a day - it's a pack or nothing. I have never allowed myself to even have a drag, I know I am a nicotine addict for life.

On June 1,2006 the province of Ontario in Canada will be 100% smoke free in all public places and work places. That means no smoke rooms, anywhere, in any office. In my office the smoke room right outside my office. People leave the door hanging open to talk. I can't believe after quitting, I have to sit here and breathe second hand smoke in an professional office. Only 1 more month to go.

Good for you for quitting. It is nasty and remember, you can't have face or body as a smoker. I can spot a smoker from miles away just from the face. And the body, it makes your skin grey and your body weak.

I am not typically a preachy non-smoker but since you opened the can of worms - lol

//Beth, have you ever thought that some of us just think it smells nasty? I go out of my way to avoid smelling other nasty chemicals. Why don't I have the right to avoid cigarette smoke? Why should other people be prey to your habit?//

i dunno. i think most perfumes smell disgusting. and yet sometimes, i am forced to ride the subway in close proximity to some woman who attempted to drown herself in Red Door. do you see me advocating for legislation stating she can't wear perfume? uh, no. sometimes people have habits that other people dislike. oh well. too bad.

i think it's blown way out of proportion, is the point i'm trying to make...and...it's the morally superior part i can't deal with. i have a habit you dislike, that's all it comes down to. if you live with a smoker who smokes a pack a day indoors, that's one thing. but walking by one on the street or walking out a door? that's a matter of aesthetics, not public health or moral rectitude.

as far as breathing problems, if you're sensitive enough that one smoker in the open air makes you literally puke, you must have a hard life. because car exhaust and charcoal grills must make you barf, too. that must be a rare autoimmune disorder i'm not familiar with.

also, moxie, i appreciate the go sox! :-)

Hmmm good point as usual Tertia. I don't dislike smoking because they are poisoning the air, or trashing their bodies (lungs, mouth, esophagus, teeth), etc. ad infinitum, I dislike smoking because it makes ME stink. Walking through or by smokers makes me stink. I don't like to smell like other peoples' unhealthy habits. Other people overeating, drinking, snorting coke, whatever, doesn't make me stink, but other people's smoking does make me stink. And smoke in my hair and clothes lingers for HOURS, I don't know why.

Smokers that balk at this, imagine if you walked by someone and they let out a noxious toot (e.g. a SBD), and you smelled like that person's intestinal gas the rest of the day. Your clothes and hair smell like it. Your pillow smells like it. Your baby smells it on you. Would you like that? Probably not. Same diff.

I am allergic to perfume. My throat swells closed worst case. Best case, I get sick to my stomach, a blinding headache, and my entire body is on fire and itching. Yet, I go into public places with people reeking of their obnoxious perfume. I get into elevators and choke. I have to endur perfume nazis at the department store who want to spray me with their weapons of death smells. I sit in offices where women pour on the perfume. Noone seems to care about that stink. Noone seems to rally around with picket signs to stop your nasty reeking perfume smell that walks into the room 10 minutes before you do.

I am a smoker. I do NOT smoke right outside the doorway to ANY public establishment. I do NOT smoke in my home or anyone else's home (I even go outside when I am with a smoker in their home and THEY smoke in their home). I do not smoke in my car when anyone else is in my car. I do not smoke in anyone else's car. I do not pick up anyone's child after I have smoked. I run away from people's children if we are outside, I am smoking, and the child comes near me. While one tiny breath of my cig smoke will NOT kill you....one breath of your perfume may kill me.

Like everything else that one can debate, there are rude smokers. There are rude women with their perfume (perfume should not be for the whole world to smell. I should have to stick my nose onto your neck to smell it). There are rude music listeners. There are rude cellphone talkers.

This debate should not be about cig smoking...it should be about consideration in general. I bet some of those bashing cig smokers also pour on the perfume and hold up the line at the bank because they are too busy gabbering away on their cellphone.

amen to what jen said.

Well, everyone should move here to Washington State then. Just recently, we passed some wonderful smoking laws! No more smoking in any public areas (restaurants or otherwise) AND no smoking within twenty-five of a doorway to those areas. Of course this has caused some "mini riots" among the smokers who say that their rights are being trampled on. Those of us with small children, allergies, asthma, etc. beg to differ. I shouldn't have to expect to have an asthma attack everytime I walk into a Target, because all of the workers are puffing away right by the door!

As for the debate of perfume/cigarette smoke, it's important to remember that cigarettes have over 4,000 chemicals - among them 40 some carcinogens and around 400 toxins. Even beyond the irritation of people smoking/causing breathing problems for others, etc. are the lifelong effects it can leave on those passers-by. As we all know, secondhand smoke is highly dangerous to others. So, in that respect, even the heaviest, stinkiest perfume (and hey, I have some severe perfume allergies, too!) doesn't hold a handle to smoking.

LOL, that's a great idea Tertia! Although, that spray stuff might be flammable...

Since opinions are like assholes, I will share mine.
If you think that bans on smoking are all about moral superiority or people not wanting to smell like smoke, you are fooling yourself. The fact of the matter is that the more you are exposed to carcinogens, the more likely you are to develop cancer. Seems like such a simple statement, doesn't it? You are killing yourself, there's no two-ways about it. For people who don't care about that, go kill yourself somewhere else. There are way more people who want to breathe clean air than there are those who wish to die a horrible painful death from lung cancer.
If your are longing for that smoke-filled pub, invite some friends over, pour yourself a glass of wine and smoke up your house til your heart's content.

I also hate hate hate the smell. Both of my brothers and my sister-in-law all smoke and when I visit my brother's house I always go home and take a shower. I swear even days later I can open up my purse and still get assailed by smoke.

Even worse, though, is the haze it puts on everything. I shared a home with my brother and SIL when my neice and nephew were small and when I moved out all of my belongings had a yellow film over them.

I am glad you are sparing your beautiful kids that yucky stuff.

The house I live in now was formerly occupied by smokers. It smelled like a bowling alley for 2 years after I moved in, despite INTENSE cleaning of ceilings, walls, carpets, etc with ammonia and other harsh get-things-REALLY-clean products. When I would shower, the steam condensing on the walls of the bathroom would run down in brownish-yellow drips from all the tar and other cigarette residue left on the walls. The walls and cieling that were originally painted white (not cream or offwhite - plain old bright white - i saw the cans) were, without exaggeration, the color of my tan shoes. When I would wash the walls or ceiling, I could see the layers of residue coming off. It took a lot of rubbing to get through all of it.
I ended up having to repaint every surface of the house with 2 or 3 coats of latex paint, AFTER many many cleanings, to finally get rid of the smell.

And that was what they EXHALED. Enough to thickly coat all surfaces of a 1200 sq ft house. Imagine what was left in their lungs. Ick.

I'm going to jump right in and piss smoker-people off, but there's another very good reason not to smoke right outside the door.

I'm athsmatic. Have been my whole life. I have two triggers. Mold and cigarette smoke.

So to me, when a dozen people hover outside the exit to a building, I can't pass through that door without ceasing breathing for awhile. I can't get far away holding my breath to not have an attack.

That's not "prissy". That's a fairly serious health concern. You have a right to smoke regardless of how bad it is for you or anyone else, but could you please do it somewhere that is not an entrance or exit point to the building, so that I can avoid it? I know some smoking bans are starting to take that into consideration (25 feet from doors sort of thing), and it is a good thing from my perspective.

oh i miss my smokes... the only reason i stopped was because i literally couldn't breathe anymore- i was having to use my asthma inhaler several times a day! and no i'm literally too afraid to risk it!
but oh how i miss them... with a fabulous red wine, with coffee, when i'm stuck in traffic... aaahh!

My embryo transfer was on December 16. I quit smoking at 11:30 p.m. on December 15. 2003. And I haven't gone back, because I did get pregnant with that IVF, though I have taken a hit or two of my friends' cigarettes since that time, but I don't do it regularly because we are still nursing. But I miss it terribly. Sigh. I wonder if that feeling ever goes away.

We are getting to be more and more like S.A. in the U.S. Lots of places are going smoke free. So it makes it a little easier to not smoke. But when I walk through a cloud by the door now, I don't get annoyed, I just miss being one of them.

My mother quit 26 years ago and I still see her glancing longinly at cigarettes when other people smoke in front of her. I think if you have that type of addictive personality and really loved smoking (she talks about it like an old friend) it never really goes away. Sorry to break it to you. Even after watching my father suffer from COPD (Emphasema) she still looks whistful when she sees an old picture of them sitting around smoking. I very luckily never started because I would have become an addict for sure. I wanted to. Badly. Guess that is the one good think asthma has ever done for me. I just couldn't inhale without my lungs protesting. My 14 year old self was pissed. My 32 year old self is very, very grateful.

Living in California, we have been working through the no-smoking in public places stuff for many years now. The next step after the no-smoking in public places, was a no-smoking within 20 feet of the door. Now several places, including my medical center have instituted a no-smoking anywhere on the property rule. A couple of cities are thinking about a no-smoking in the city rule -- which may be going a bit far, but still--it's something to ponder. It is amazing to me that there can be one person smoking on an entire block, and that smoke will go right up my nose.

So hang in there. It will get better as more people become ex-smokers and as the nicotine clears out of the air, and people can think more clearly about the poison and how much of it they want in their bodies.

Most of Canada has banned smoking in public places, hooray hooray. The people at doorways are very annoying, to say the least, especially to me, my husband and my son who all have allergies and asthma. We're allergic to perfume too, or I would enjoy your idea of squirting the smokers with cheap and nasty perfume!

Tertia I'm so glad you have quit smoking, for your own health, and for your children. The stink is nothing compared to the health risks. Please don't be tempted to start again! I hope that Marko will consider quitting too. Hope you both live long healthy lives and get to be active grandparents some day!

The best place to smoke without smoking is a university. Seriously, when I was in college 10 years ago, everyone would immediately light up upon walking out the door. Our university was built on a nature preserve, so there is quite a lot of walking outdoors. By the time I reached my next class, I'd had at least 4 vicarious cigarettes, if not more. I considered taking it up because at least it would be filtered.

Today it's smokers who are the pariahs. Who's it gonna be tomorrow. How about drinkers? Drivers? Overweight people? Pet owners? It's ok being sanctimonious today, but remember that tomorrow, when it's *your* turn.

A couple of weeks ago, I was taking my baby to the hospital for another echocardiogram (she has heart issues). I had parked and was hauling baby + bag stuffed with "interesting" toys to distract her, across the packed parking lot, towards the only entrance to this building. Just in front of the entrance, actually blocking the (only) walking path were a good handful of nurses/CNAs, all smoking. There was no way around them, and I was pretty annoyed because of the huge cloud of smoke that I couldn't avoid and because I literally had to elbow my way through them. I'm probably hypersensitive, as I have severe asthma and 3 kids who were all preemies with respiratory issues, and I get all kinds of icky allergic reactions to smoke (not just to cigarette smoke, to certain kinds of wood smoke as well). But geez, it was a hospital.

I'm sure that people who wear perfume that makes other people sick don't realize how noxious that might be to a person sensitive to the issue, just like I'm sure that smokers may not realize how noxious cigarette smoke is to some.

For me personally, it's an issue of both courtesy and health.

you have hit it RIGHT ON THE HEAD! i get sooooooooooo ooo ooooooooooooooo annoyed when people smoke right in the main pathway into a building. when i was working w/ the students' union at my college a few years back, i actually helped another student initiate a campus-wide smoking ban so that, after trudging up the huge hill to GET to college, we didn't have to huff and puff our way through poison fumes to enter the building.

here in bc, canada, smoking is also banned in all public places. now if only i could convince my downstairs neighbours that when the landlord said NO SMOKING INSIDE, he actually meant NO SMOKING INSIDE. don't MAKE my 30 weeks pregnant ass come down there and smash you around. bastards.

i've never smoked (cigarettes), but my parents did, and i suppose that's where i got my rage from - the indignity of having to put up with second hand smoke my whole life! whereas my partner's parents didn't smoke, so he has a rather cavalier attitude about it. when it comes to our baby, though, i'm sure we're gonna be stricter than strict about ppl smoking around him or her. grr!

hope the getaway is going swell ;)

Yes, Jen Earthchild. Yes. Yes. Yes.

The overweight already are pariahs. (I love that word)

I don't care who smokes - but I do care if I have to walk through it myself or drag my babies through it. I also hate perfume. I've noticed that in my building the obnoxious perfume wearers are the smokers who pour it on to cover up the smoke stink. There is one thing worse than smoke stink and that's smoke stink drowing in perfume. BARF.

PS - I should learn to smell "drowning".

Also - it was 2 years before I realized my MIL was a smoker. She never smelled. She was a courteous smoker. I had a former co-worker who was the same.

I don't dislike smokers - I dislike the smell of the smoke.

Need more coffee. I can't SPELL.

Let's not fool ourselves thinking that because smokers are outside, we are breathing clean air. Clean-ish? ok, Cleaner? maybe but definitely not Clean.
I'm a social smoker, if someone is smoking, I'll probably smoke too. If no one is smoking I won't be the first to light one. I also like to think of myself as a considerate smoker. I always ask if it's ok to smoke, I can't smoke outside unless I have an ashtray because I'm unable to throw the ashes or the cigarrete butt on the street.
So, I would like to ask, what do you think a considerate smoker should do? I got the no standing at the door, and moving so the kids won't get smoke. Can you think of some other things? I'm just not a fan of the us versus them mentality.

Good for you for quitting!

I'm not a smoker... Don't get excited though because its only been 26 days without a smoke. That being said, I'd like to address the issue of the polite smoker. When I smoked, I:

never smoked in someone's house

never smoked in my house since my husband is a nonsmoker [exception - when its chilly outside, I would smoke inside DIRECTLY in front of the fireplace, WITH a fire going to draw the smoke up the floo.

never smoked in front of children for two reasons: didn't want to model undesirable behavior and didn't want to be the reason their little clothing smelled or the reason they coughed/had an asthma attack

never smoked in any area other than the designated smoking areas

never smoked after a meal in an outdoor restaurant without waiting for everyone to finish their food and asking permission first

I don't want to be annoying ex-smoker and I try to be aware of my choice to quit shouldn't impact my smoking friends.

We had a party on Easter Sunday and had approximately 8 smokers there. I put out ash trays in our courtyard and around the outdoor furniture. I put out lighters for folks to use. When it started to rain, I lit the fire inside and put an ashtray next to it for folks to smoke if they needed to.

Its a choice people make. We are all adults and have the choice to smoke or not. I don't want to make anyone uncomfortable for their choices and I tried not to inconvenience people when I did smoke.

Meh - I don't know what the point of my post is except to say that in general, I think I was a polite smoker and in my experience, most of the people who smoke here seem to be polite about it too.

Oh - and did I mention that I really miss it sometimes?

My brother and sister and I all had respiratory problems (allergies, asthma) until we grew up and left home. It was because my dad smoked around us all the time. He's apologized since.

I'm not a fan of perfume, never ever wear it myself, and I do detest the perfume nazis at department stores. Wave them away, shaking my head. But I've never had a sore throat and a migraine from being around somebody else's perfume all day.

You lucky bastards. You actually get a smoking room in your building? Us US types reserve that right for the international airports. You know, to keep the spoiled foreigners happy.

Yeah, I'm a smoker who will eventually give it up. Hell, I'm childless, not trying, in the prime of my life. Why stifle myself? I figure I've got plenty of time to grow up and act adult. I'm only 25, for cryin' out loud.

Having said all that, I never smoke around anyone who isn't ok with it and I always always avoid smoking around random strangers. At work, I smoke in my car on my break. At home, I go outside or into the garage. I never used to, but then again I never had a large sense of pride about the places I lived in until recently.

Smoking is a huge issue almost everywhere now, it seems. For good reason. But I'd rather not be treated like I have the plague when I do it as respectfully as I do. And honestly? I'm not. Because I'm respectful.

Make any sense? I've had some wine... ;)

And also:

I never smoke around children, and children love me. I will sneak off and hide to smoke, if I am around kids. If they find me, I hide my cigarette and tell them to go back inside (or comparitively similar), I will be there in a moment.

Even when dining in the smoking section of a restaraunt, I will not smoke unless no one else at the table is eating. And I will ask before lighting my cig.

The only people I feel at complete ease smoking around are my mother (who has smoked for 20-some years) and my best friend, who has actually told me to "Please do, I love the smell." She's one of two people I've met in my lifetime who have told me that they love the smell, that's why they never started, because they knew they wouldn't be able to stop.

The only house I smoke in is my parents', because my mom has smoked there since we moved in.

I do feel like a pariah. However, I recognise that if it weren't for my own empathy, that would not be the case.

I don't think this issue has to do with the law, I think that this issue has to do with general lack of compassion. I don't smoke in my car because I have to. I smoke in my car because unlike those people huddled at the doorway of the restaraunt, I'm not belligerant about my bad habit. I don't want to force other people to be around it.

//You have a right to smoke regardless of how bad it is for you or anyone else, but could you please do it somewhere that is not an entrance or exit point to the building, so that I can avoid it? I know some smoking bans are starting to take that into consideration (25 feet from doors sort of thing), and it is a good thing from my perspective.//

so how's this gonna work? especially in a city or thickly settled area in which every single doorway is 25 feet or less than another? basically this is saying, "let's ban smoking outdoors, too, because we don't like the smell." awesome. gotta love it when ppl try to legislate others' behavior for their own convenience.

at least come off the "smokers have a right..." tip. either we do, or we don't. if you think we don't, frigging make the things illegal already. of course, given how well Prohibition worked, maybe that's not the best idea, either...

Ah yes, I fondly remember my smoking days. It has been 7 years in May since I smoked (w/ the exception of a couple of one-night binges that gave me smoking hang-overs).

But I do agree that it stinks. In fact for quite some time I would only smoke clove cigarettes cause they smelled so yummy and sweet - they burned hotter than hell, but at least it smelled nice.

As for smoker etiquette, I'd say that all in all most smokers are courteous about their smoking. There are some occassions where I get a waft of smoke in my face, but it doesn't bother me. The only time it bothers me is when there is stale smoke in fabrics, like in a hotel room or something.

I don't smoke, don't wear perfume and don't use any product that is fragranced due to allergies.

But I do drop chronic SBD farts in public places. Yes, that was me. Sorry.

Siobhan - I say spray the smokers, drinkers, drivers, overweight AND pet owners. Phsssssssssst!

Oh, I'm 3 out of 5 of those. Bugger! Phsssssssssst.


"The heaviest stinkiest perfume" does "hold a candle" to second hand smoke if your throat closes up like mine does. In that case, my second hand smoke will take years to kill you, your stinky perfume will take minutes to kill me.

Personally, Beth, I do think cigarettes should be taken off the market. I think the prohibition comparison falls through in this: while medical studies have long shown that it is possible to drink in moderation and either benefit or suffer no ill effects, I have seen no evidence to that effect for smoking. Also, if I drink it doesn't risk you unless I drive afterwards, which IS illegal.

But that's a personal feeling and not something I can see being legislated or really have any interest in legislating. Pipe dream, if you will.

Wouldn't it be nice if cigarettes magically didn't exist at all and none of us had this addiction? I've never smoked, but because both my parents did, I have a nicotene addiction ... I get the shakes when I see it and "taste" it because I want it that badly. Even though it makes me stop breathing (which is probably the biggest reason I don't smoke myself).

I also think that all petrol burning cars should be taken off the market and replaced immediately with something that doesn't produce carbon monoxide at no difference in cost to consumers. Like I said... pipe dream.


I watched my father die from lung cancer and my husband's father too.
I'm SO glad you don't smoke now and please never do it again.


Beth, give it up. Smoke 'til you die for all I care, but give up your defensiveness. We've got you outnumbered.

I became asthmatic several years ago, and smoke is one of my triggers. I'm also prone to headaches. The things that trigger an instant asthmatic cough include cigarette smoke and wood/leaf smoke; a headache may overtake me with either type of smoke as well as heavy perfumes. Cara exhaust and bus fumes, oddly enough, annoy me no end but don't seem to narrow my airways. Ozone-type air pollution absolutely gives me breathing trouble, though.

The smell of freshly pooped feces, freshly hurled vomit, or a stinky fart may make me retch, but they don't close my airways like smoke does. I'm lucky that I've never had a serious asthma attack, but it's frightening that it could happen at any time. I'm 100% in favor of anti-smoking legislation. (I'd even like to see a "no smoking outdoors in this area" law—there are precedents, such as the fact that it's not legal to have sex out in public, but totally fine within your own home.)

(Psst: Jodie Buckland is funny!)

I smoke. Have smoked a pack a day since I went to college at 17. Smoked roughly a pack a week before that..since I was 14. I'm 38. We are in the process of adopting a 14 month old that we have had since he was 7 months. I cannot quit. My husband and I go out onto the deck to smoke. He watches us. We smoke with him in the back seat and hold it out the window. We have promised to quit the day we sign the adoption papers.

all you ex smokers PLEASE tell me how you did it. I simply cannot imagine my life without a cigarette. It is pathetic..yes I know. But it is who I AM!!! HELP ME!! Email Lharmget480@aol.com with suggestions PLEASE!!

Aw, it's cool Beth, I'll be your fellow smoker in crime.

We have a lovely outside deck at my workplace, a welcome change from my last job...where the designated smoking area was RIGHT NEXT TO THE DOOR! Duh people.

mmm cigarettes...yummy tarry deliciousness.

I used to be a defensive smoker. Also used to be one of the people calling ex-smokers the worst non-smokers. Now the only people who think that about me are people who still smoke. Smokers seem to resent people who've successfully quit. It's been 3 1/2+ years (YAY!) I am amazed at how badly my clothes, hair & breath had to have reeked based on what I can smell now on other smokers. I honestly couldn't smell it when I smoked, so I didn't know how offensive it really is. Like Tertia said, I don't want to suffer the effects without getting to smoke 'em myself.

Timely post, Tertia.

I don't know if this point has already been made in these comments, but for those of you who have children and are smokers I'd like for you to think about what I am going through right now:

My mother has Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease (COPD) caused by smoking just a few cigarettes a day - even though she quit 10 years ago. At least once a year I get that phone call from a sibling or my Dad telling me mom is in the hospital, and that panic sets in...she recovers, then we do it all again. Only now it is happening more than just once a year.

I am only 33, and there is almost no chance she will live long enough to know my kids. One of the worst things about all our troubles with carrying a pg to term is that I feel like we are running out of time to have a baby before my mom dies.

Please, don't make a choice today that I can promise you will break your children's hearts when they are adults. You have to love your kids more than you love yourself.

I have an entire post titled "Smokers" on my site.

Congrats! I hit two years on Friday (April 21)...we were in the midst of trying to get pregnant, I was driving home from work and I decided, two cigarettes left, I'm gonna quit. I got home to a full pack my husband had purchased for me and decided, one more pack. I had the last cigarette out of that pack around 11pm on April 21st, 2004. I quit cold turkey, no patch, no pill. It was the hardest thing I ever did. Around month three, I was having a really hard time and I really wanted a cigarette. Didn't have it though - I got pregnant around that time and never looked back.

My husband still smokes, but not in the house any more (I couldn't and still can't stand the smell of smoke any more. it grosses me out now!). I really don't have much of an opinion of the smoking bans, except I think that bars shouldn't need to have no smoking. Bar in a restaurant, yes, plain old bar to hang out in, let em smoke.

Your Idea of taking a can of air freshner with you is great. I think I will take one with me also for the non smokers that fart on the way up the elevator.You non smokers are sick perverted people. How about us smokers that have no kids get, a law past that says we don`t have to pay your fucking school tax. So shut the fuck up or we just might.

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